Prototype Tim Mills' Photos

[mickoo]

I'm in agreement with Mick, 40's on the south end of the ECML were not a frequent event, the Bradford newspaper train did sometimes get one but that was the only reasonably regular working. On the south end of the MML pretty rare, that was Peak country.
That's far more likely to be the north west of the country, those chimneys look just like those that Fred Dibner spent his life taking down.

Richard

I used to see them occasionally at Peterborough on London trains in the early 80's on Cleethorpes, Hull or Newcastle, sometimes Leeds trains in the summer, not many mind, they weren't super rare and probably stand in's or extra trains.

 

[Roger Pound]

The date is pre 1983 so that kind of rules out the ECML and MML extensions and that catenary is not new nor that track bed and I cannot recall ever seeing a 40 on the MML, not to say it didn't happen but odds are stacked against it.

Just in passing, in the very early days of dieselisation English Electric Type 4's as we called them then were used occasionally on passenger workings on the MML. The rapid appearance of the Peaks (44/45/45) quickly replaced them on passenger work and they became virtually unknown on the MML from the East Midlands MML to the capital. The allocation on the London Midland Region class 40s then seemed confined to workings on the WCML.
Just a recollection of times spent at the lineside in my youth......... .

Roger

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Done some more trawling and concur with @mickoo - it's Preston. The chimneys in the background were Ribble Power Station which is now a golf course.

 

[hrmspaul]

There are not many areas on the ECML and MML north of London where there are greater than four tracks.

That is a very strange comment. In my youth I remember reading the longest stretch of 4 track mainline in Britain was St. P to Kettering (or thereabouts) over 80 miles.

Of course, they didn't necessarily run close to one another. The freight lines being added later were to a gentler gradient and whereas the passenger line went over the Northampton Hills the freight line went through.

Photos of how this affected the MML Midland Railway and Midland Lines in BR times | Peak__m_
Midland Railway and Midland Lines in BR times | Tunnels south of Elstree 67-05-20 � Paul Bartlett w
Midland Railway and Midland Lines in BR times | Brick road Bridge between Bedford & Wellingborough 67-05-20 � Paul Bartlett w
Midland Railway and Midland Lines in BR times | Bridges between Bedford & Leicester 67-05-20 � Paul Bartlett w
Midland Railway and Midland Lines in BR times | Brick road underbridge between Bedford & Wellingborough 67-05-20 � Paul Bartlett w

Paul

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

That is a very strange comment. In my youth I remember reading the longest stretch of 4 track mainline in Britain was St. P to Kettering (or thereabouts) over 80 miles.

The moment came when I was initially looking at the class 40 photo as the 6' way track spacing didn't look correct for the ECML or MML near London which lead me to think of a 5 or 6 track section.

Of course we now know the class 40 photo was taken at Preston.

I think north of Bedford now it has been reduced to 3 tracks to Ketting/Glendon Junction.

 

[oldravendale]

That's a very impressive bit of research and photos about the location of the Class 40, Mick @mickoo, now re enforced by the comments and photos from Dave @Yorkshire Dave , Martin @40057 and memories from Richard @richard carr and Roger @Roger Pound . Thanks also, Paul @hrmspaul for the detail and reference photos for the MML. Thanks also, Mick @mickoo for all that info about the Deltics - if there was one person to know it's you and I was hopeful that you'd fill in the blanks. A favour though, please Mick. Would you add an img number to your descriptions for me... I've tried to match the photos but my head is spinning!

This group of photos were taken in October 1979. The first two are of Loughborough Midland Station and the next four of unidentified blue Class 45 or 46 diesels at Loughborough.













Another shot at Loughborough Midland in October 1979 but this time of Class 25 25270. It was introduced when new to Eastfield as D7620 on 26th August 1966 in two tone green with small yellow warning panel. By May 1971 it was blue with full yellow cab front and became 25270 in June 1974. After Eastfield home allocations were Preston Division July 1968, Nottingham Division November 1968, Bescot November 1973, Toton June 1974 where it was withdrawn on 28th November 1982 going to Swindon Works where it was scrapped on 30th June 1986.



Another unidentified Class 45 or 46 diesel at Loughborough Midland in October 1979.

​

A pair of class 20 diesels, 20073 leading, the geography showing it to be at Loughborough Midland in October 1979. This loco went new to Eastfield on 19th July 1961, then Polmadie in March 1969, back to Eastfield the following June and then the Nottingham Division from November in November 1969 where it was withdrawn on 23rd December 1993 going to C F Booth at Rotherham where it was scrapped in April 2006. The original number was D8073 and it was renumbered 20073 in March 1974. When introduced to traffic it was green with grey rood and red buffer beams but I have no information about when it was repainted blue. (BR Database).



Brian

 

[hrmspaul]

img190 TM Oct 79 copyright Final.jpg​

​

Oh lets play the game of spot the parcels stock.​

BR Bogie BG, SR Bogie B, two BR 4-wh CCT, SR 4 wh either PMV or CCT, LMS bogie BG (I think) and then gets vague on my screen although another SR 4 wh either PMV or CCT 3 from end and I think the last is another BR Bogie BG

img192 TM Loughborough Midland Oct 79 copyright Final.jpg and​

img186 TM Class 45 or 46 poss Loughborough Midland Oct 79 copyright Final.jpg​

3 ballast Mermaids with the 08 shunter.

Paul

 

[mickoo]

Thanks also, Mick @mickoo for all that info about the Deltics - if there was one person to know it's you and I was hopeful that you'd fill in the blanks. A favour though, please Mick. Would you add an img number to your descriptions for me... I've tried to match the photos but my head is spinning!

I posted my list in the order that you posted your images.

55 022
55 009
55 016
55 021

 

[76043]

3 ballast Mermaids with the 08 shunter.

Paul

BIt what about the colour of the 08? Appears to be in BR primer or yellow all over? Private owner?
Tony

 

[mickoo]

BIt what about the colour of the 08? Appears to be in BR primer or yellow all over? Private owner?
Tony

ARC private owner 08 File:0-6-0 shunter no. 3101 in the ARC sidings next to the old goods shed, Loughborough Midland station, Nigel Tout.jpg - Wikimedia Commons

 

[RonnieS]

That's a very impressive bit of research and photos about the location of the Class 40, Mick @mickoo, now re enforced by the comments and photos from Dave @Yorkshire Dave , Martin @40057 and memories from Richard @richard carr and Roger @Roger Pound . Thanks also, Paul @hrmspaul for the detail and reference photos for the MML. Thanks also, Mick @mickoo for all that info about the Deltics - if there was one person to know it's you and I was hopeful that you'd fill in the blanks. A favour though, please Mick. Would you add an img number to your descriptions for me... I've tried to match the photos but my head is spinning!

This group of photos were taken in October 1979. The first two are of Loughborough Midland Station and the next four of unidentified blue Class 45 or 46 diesels at Loughborough.

View attachment 256058

View attachment 256059

View attachment 256060

View attachment 256061

View attachment 256062

View attachment 256063

Another shot at Loughborough Midland in October 1979 but this time of Class 25 25270. It was introduced when new to Eastfield as D7620 on 26th August 1966 in two tone green with small yellow warning panel. By May 1971 it was blue with full yellow cab front and became 25270 in June 1974. After Eastfield home allocations were Preston Division July 1968, Nottingham Division November 1968, Bescot November 1973, Toton June 1974 where it was withdrawn on 28th November 1982 going to Swindon Works where it was scrapped on 30th June 1986.

View attachment 256064

Another unidentified Class 45 or 46 diesel at Loughborough Midland in October 1979.

​

View attachment 256065

A pair of class 20 diesels, 20073 leading, the geography showing it to be at Loughborough Midland in October 1979. This loco went new to Eastfield on 19th July 1961, then Polmadie in March 1969, back to Eastfield the following June and then the Nottingham Division from November in November 1969 where it was withdrawn on 23rd December 1993 going to C F Booth at Rotherham where it was scrapped in April 2006. The original number was D8073 and it was renumbered 20073 in March 1974. When introduced to traffic it was green with grey rood and red buffer beams but I have no information about when it was repainted blue. (BR Database).

View attachment 256066

Brian

I hesitate to ask this because its hard to say without sounding rude! Have you exhausted the B R steam photos?

You know you have spoilt me with page after page of superb enthusiasm inspiring images. Thanks.

 

[oldravendale]

Thanks for your identification of the vehicles in those photos, Paul @hrmspaul and then the further info about the private 08, Mick. Once more Tim has, almost certainly accidentally, picked up the unusual in his photos.

@RonnieS There are more steam photos to come. In order to avoid confusing my rather inadequate brain I'm putting these images up here in the order in which I have them filed. I'm also aware that blue diesels are, for some reason, of considerable interest to a growing number in our fraternity.


This photo of Bagnall 0-6-0T 3061 Empress is at an unidentified location in October 1979. For details see W G Bagnall Works No 3061 Empress 0-6-0ST



There follow 52 slides (!) on the GCR, and there will be others to come, I estimate around year 2000 but (unless there’s an overwhelming wish to see them all) I’ll select the best. It’ll still be quite a few. Fortunately Tim dated a few of these but for the others, using the visiting engines Tim photographed as references it should be possible to narrow the dates down but I've not attempted that yet.

On 11th February 1998 B12 8572 and B1 1306 were visiting the GCR and here double head a train at Quorn Station. Details for each loco are here: B12 61500 – 61580 4-6-0 GER Holden and 61306 Mayflower



And here is the B12 ready for duty at Loughborough on 11th February 1998.



8F 48305 and N2 69523, two members of the then home fleet, at Quorn on an unknown date. The 8F still resides at Loughborough although sadly the N2 left the GCR a while ago after many years service for some new adventures. Details for the 8F are here 48305 (LMS 8303 & BR 48305) and for the N2 here 69523 (GNR 1744, LNER 4744, LNER 9523 & BR 69523)



Two 0-6-0 diesel shunters, Class 10 D4067 and Class 08 13180 here at Loughborough on an unknown date. The Class 10 still resides at Loughborough – see UK & Ireland Heritage Railway Locomotives Database, includes both steam locomotives and diesel engines. but the Class 08 has visited the Epping Ongar Railway but is now probably back at its home base at Ruddington on the GCR North in blue as 08114 UK & Ireland Heritage Railway Locomotives Database, includes both steam locomotives and diesel engines.



Brian

 

[PhilH]

The photo of EMPRESS Bagnall 3061 was taken inside the loco shed at Cadley Hill Colliery, it didn't leave Cadley Hill for preservation until April 1987. The red loco in front is PROGRESS RSH 7298/46, which later went to the Tanfield Railway.

Cadley Hill became a collecting point for steam locos, although a diesel was available and normally used. Maybe the manager was an enthusiast !
On an IRS visit in April 1976 six steam locos were present and all were subsequently preserved as listed in the link in Brian's post. On that date EMPRESS was in the stores yard covered with a tarpaulin.

 

[JimJim]

Looking at the array of cars in the car park at Quorn I would say the mid nineties. The BMW 520 (L273MRC) bottom right was first registered 20/12/93.

Jim

 

[RonnieS]

@RonnieS There are more steam photos to come.

Wow! What a super resource. Thank you so much.

 

[oldravendale]

Phil @PhilH - thanks for the info about "Empress". If that was, as you suspect, photographed at Cadley Hill they either loved their steam engines or otherwise took great care of them. I don't think I've ever seen a colliery loco so clean.

Then Jim @JimJim . I much appreciate your observation. That helps in narrowing the date down and would fit the visual details of the photo.

Ronnie @RonnieS - more to come... a lot more to come.

Visiting Jubilee 5593 Kolhapur and Rebuilt West Country 34039 Boscastle from the home fleet double head a train for Leicester North at Swithland on an unknown date. Details for the Jubilee are here 45593 Kolhapur (LMS 5593 & BR 45593) The West Country has an important place in the history of the preserved GCR as it was the first loco to arrive on the railway albeit in Barry Scrapyard condition. I admit a personal interest here – I’ve invested in the loco and recently “bought” a large tube. It’s an ideal locomotive to inspire the original aspirations of the GCR to preserve a working main line from the days of steam. After a rebuild taking many years it saw service on the GCR but was withdrawn for another overhaul since when, despite a great deal of work being carried out, it remains incomplete. In July 2022 a large number of machined and completed parts were stolen from storage including substantial parts of the inside valve gear. Work is being completed on finalising the insurance claim which has involved locating suppliers but the value of the missing parts is likely to be in the order of £100,000.00, probably at least twenty times the scrap value of the stolen components. Nevertheless a new and enthusiastic fund raising drive is in progress. 34039 Boscastle (SR 21C139 & BR 34039) In the second photo the Jubilee is at Loughborough Central Station. The colour of the buffer beam suggests it’s having a repaint.





This is Boscastle soon after the previous rebuild.



I don’t have a date for this picture of two visiting Jubilees outside Loughborough Shed with, I believe, the boiler of 48305 alongside. Details about 45593 are in the previous post but here is information about double chimney 45596 Bahamas.

45596 Bahamas (LMS 5596 & BR 45596)

Bahamas was built in 1934 as LMS 5596 by North British Locomotive Co. at Queens Park, For many years the locomotive carried works plates identifying it as having been completed in January 1935. Thi…

preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com

Black 5 5231 was a very early arrival at Loughborough and gave good service to the railway. It was eventually owned by the railway but regrettably sold during a time of financial stringency. The date of these photos is not known but the first is on a mixed freight passing through Swithland Sidings and the second the loco in Loughborough Shed Yard. Details of the loco are here: 45231 (LMS 5231 & BR 45231)





Brian

 

[Mike Walker]

Both Jubilees were present for a gala in June 1995 so it could well be around then.

 

[Genghis]

Cadley Hill became a collecting point for steam locos, although a diesel was available and normally used. Maybe the manager was an enthusiast !

IIRC there was a report in the IRS Journal noting that one of the other NCB areas offered ‘antique dinosaurs in good working order’. Only Cadley Hill took up the offer. The colliery manager must have had a soft spot. The fact that the final fleet survived is perhaps testament to the care they were given.

 

[oldravendale]

That's very helpful Mike @Mike Walker . I don't personally remember any occasion when there were two Jubilees on the GC. By way of explanation although I've been involved with the railway since the very earliest days there was a fallow period when I resigned all my committees and didn't visit as a result of having a considerably more demanding job and was both in the UK and abroad, often travelling at short notice.

And Dave @Genghis - your comments about Cadley Hill are quite appropriate as I wonder if that photo is well out of sequence. Well, really there's very little in the way of sequence anyway! That photo of Empress is img191. I'm now processing img2873. There are some pics at Cadley Hill around img2938 in a box entitled " Fairford Rally. Quainton 1969. Tyesley 1970" but the stamped date on the slide mounts for the Cadley Hill photos is October 1979. I hope I'll be capable of magicking up some information but I'm yet to start processing these. I guess the photo of Empress could have been taken on the same day.

Two photos at unknown dates of visiting Castle 5029 Nunney Castle, the first at Swithland and the second making a spirited exit from Loughborough Central. Details of the loco are here: 5029 Nunney Castle





A visiting Jinty on the GCR – date unknown – but I’ve not yet identified the precise location. It’s Jinty 47279 which normally lives on the KWVR. Details here: 47279 (LMS 7119, LMS 7279 and BR 47279)



Flying Scotsman at Loughborough on the GCR on an unknown date. I suggest little more needs to be said except that it will be visiting GCR(N) this year.



Whilst I have no date for this one I believe it to be at Didcot Parkway. What cannot be in dispute is that it’s Castle 5029 Nunney Castle – details are above but repeated here for convenience:

5029 Nunney Castle

Great Western Railway Castle Class No.5029 Nunney Castle was built at Swindon Works in 1934, and takes the name of a small castle near Frome, Somerset. The locomotive was used in many pub…

preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com

Two photos here on an unknown date in the vicinity of Covent Garden with Routemaster RML2533, JJD533D and the first also featuring Volvo B10M G145TYT, Cowie fleet No 145. The Routemaster was introduced to London Transport in July 1966 and is here on Route 19 to Battersea Bridge when probably operated by Arriva London South as successors to Kentish Bus. It may even be one of the few still operating in London although I have no confirmation of that. See: https://www.buslistsontheweb.co.uk/...o.uk/list.asp?ListName=1173&Type=&Page=2&WW=0 The Volvo was introduced in February 1990 to Cowies N19 otherwise known as Grey-Green and is here on rote 24 to Pimlico.




Brian

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Two photos here on an unknown date in the vicinity of Covent Garden with Routemaster RML2533, JJD533D and the first also featuring Volvo B10M G145TYT, Cowie fleet No 145.

They are on the Charing Cross Road at Cambridge Circus. The date will be between February 1990 and 1996 as Covent Garden Records (shop behind bus stop D) closed in 1995.

For those in literary circles Covent Garden Records is 84 Charing Cross Road. Today it is a fast food restaurant.