Ex-GWR Toad Brake Van Help please?

Phill Dyson

Phill Dyson

Western Thunderer
Hi :)

Can anyone shed any light on the running number of this Toad Brake Van?.....

ex-GWR Toad.jpg

The pic was taken in June 1975 & I wouldn't have though there could be that many still running in 1975?

The van was restored on the Dart Valley Railway before being reclaimed by BR, which explains the bizarre livery (thanks AJC)

So if anyone could help with a running number or even a list of Toad's that were still running in 1975 I would very pleased to hear from you!;)

Many Thanks

Phill :)
 
Phill Dyson

Phill Dyson

Western Thunderer
Thanks Mike:) , I have emailed the SDR Wagon & Carriage Dept in the hope they can provide any info at all..........my own search for further info has so far been fruitless :(
 
SteadyRed

SteadyRed

Western Thunderer
Being bored this evening I have searched high & low on the internet to see if I could find any reference to the vehicle being returned to BR from the Dart Valley Rly, sadly I didn't.

Couldn't find any reference to any TOADs being used either in revenue or engineers service into the 1970s. Probably a fascinating story behind this one end up back on BR metals.

Tried comparing the posted image with images of preserved TOADs, firstly I found a website listing 70+ preserved TOADs then went looking for images of them. The items which stood out on the photo you posted are BR style black background for the running numbers, also the inverted "V" shaped rain strip over the gate, and lastly the pipe style complete hand rail. I know a very long shot.

Having trawled through every image of a TOAD I could find sadly non, in whatever condition match the picture from 1975.

Ah well I hope you get an answer either from the railway or from some other source.


Dave

PS waiting for my soldering iron to arrive, other wise I wouldnt have time to go on such a wild goose chase.
 
AJC

AJC

Western Thunderer
I should add that my source is entirely anecdotal; my dad, who was involved in the early days of the Dart Valley at Ashburton and Buckfastleigh. Since we're talking about freight stock, the chances of any such anecdote being recorded on the 'web are limited in the extreme. There's a very real possibility that the van was scrapped after its use with BR. Whether he was specifically involved with this brakevan I doubt but I haven't spoken to him to ask for specifics, but thinking about it, there is someone that might know; will drop him an email.

Adam
 
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Phill Dyson

Phill Dyson

Western Thunderer
Thanks Dave & Paul:)

I think that I too have exhausted the internet & I am now searching my copies of 1970's Railway Magazine & Railway World, lots of interesting stuff.......apart from of course ex-DVR Toad Brake vans:rolleyes:

I will now search my BR(WR) books......I may be gone sometime:eek:

Phill :)

Plan 'B' is to make the bloody number up!
 
AJC

AJC

Western Thunderer
Just emailed dad and his response confirms what I'd remembered (no number sadly):

"...a couple of people repainted it, then some BR staff checked TOPS and found it was at Totnes in theory. It was used for several years afterwards." As the photo shows, the repaint was only partial - the inner end of the veranda looks like a version of GW wagon grey, the rest a BR paint job.

Adam
 
ZiderHead

ZiderHead

Western Thunderer
Just a thought - if it was restored by DVR before returning to BR it should have been in pretty good condition and may have been returned to DVR after BR had done with it rather than being scrapped (also presumably the restoration was at DVR's cost.) In which case this one just might be a candidate:

W 35413 20t Goods brake van TOAD
Built by BR(WR) at Swindon in 1949 on Lot 1497 to GWR diagram AA23.
Moved to WSR from Dart Valley Railway in 1988. Subsequently transferred to the Swanage Railway in 1994.
Click to expand...

(from http://www.uksteam.info/wsr/stock.htm)


Edit: It looks like this one is now at ESR:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/25830408@N08/9085692946/lightbox/
 
ZiderHead

ZiderHead

Western Thunderer
Are there any other Toads listed in it? I only ask because the pic above looks to be of a Diag/AA23 and 68777 seems to be a Diag/AA20.

The most obvious difference being the outside frame angle irons which tuck under the top of the sole bar on the AA20 and other earlier Diags, but which extend straight down to the bottom of the sole bar on the AA23.

Compare:
68777 http://www.ws.vintagecarriagestrust.org/ws/WagonInfo.asp?Ref=6485
35413 http://www.ws.vintagecarriagestrust.org/ws/WagonInfo.asp?Ref=7977
 
AJC

AJC

Western Thunderer
ZiderHead said:
Just a thought - if it was restored by DVR before returning to BR it should have been in pretty good condition and may have been returned to DVR after BR had done with it rather than being scrapped (also presumably the restoration was at DVR's cost.)
Click to expand...

"restored" is probably stretching it a bit; partial repaint is nearer the mark and the paint might well have been paid for by the chaps doing the work as was the way with a lot of what the DVR got up to back then (so dad tells me and he spent a fair bit of time wielding a paintbrush). At this stage of the preservation era, quite a lot was paid for by means of a whip-round and I'm far from sure that BR would have seen it as an 'obligation' to send it 'back', especially since the thing was inadvertently pinched in the first place. It is possible that it went back to Buckfastleigh at some later date but it may not be there now - it may not even be in existence.

Quite a number of vehicles have wandered around the world of preservation. Another vehicle dad was involved with at Buckfastleigh ended up fairly shortly afterwards at the nascent SVR (it's still there: http://svrtrust.org.uk/our-vehicles/lms/2886-2.html).


Adam
 
ZiderHead

ZiderHead

Western Thunderer
Ahh so it was more of a "cosmetic restoration" then :D

Would love to know how it accidentally transferred from Totnes to the DVR, whatever its number this van certainly had an interesting history :)
 
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